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Thirteen: General, All general Thirteen discussion
JoshC.
post Jul 15 2009, 7:55 PM
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QUOTE (Inaudible-Whisper @ Jul 15 2009, 2:19 PM) *
I'm not saying definitely, I just think it's a best guess right now. The theme matches, and the element shown would fit in with what we know. I think it will be like Air in that it'll be a twist on an existing element to make it technically a world first - a backwards tilt. 99% of the general public won't even know a tilt coaster exists at all. I don't think a tilt should be any less likely just because we've been shown one and it's a secret weapon. At the end of the day, it's still guess work so their secret is still kept.

The trouble with that theory is that it would then not be a world's first. AT have on a couple of occasions stated it would be a world first, and a tilt coaster would not be a world first.

As for Air not being a world first, couldn't it be argued that Vekoma flyers more known as Lay down coasters, hence the reason for the loading technique, as opposed to a true flying coaster? That would then make Air the first true flying coaster.
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EdwinOkli
post Jul 15 2009, 8:12 PM
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Okay... I just had to look up what a tilt coaster actually was because so many people are going on about it.
To be honest, I can't ever see a tilt coaster coming to Alton Towers... there's simply not the height room although they are digging down - it depends how far they're digging down.

If a tilt was the major world's first feature it wouldn't be marketable, it wouldn't be secret and inside the building it would have to be. Also, a tilt would be too much like oblivion's vertical drop - we don't need another.

Meh, whatever's in that hole will be a secret, the world's first element will be much more obvious. Two world first elements? Would be a world first.
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chapmanmania
post Jul 16 2009, 3:37 AM
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QUOTE (garyholc @ Jul 14 2009, 5:17 PM) *
Would be good - though again I question if the ride throughput would not suffer too much...? Its going to have to be at least a minute inside that building for there to be a decent story and effects.... I think whatever it is, it will tie in somehow with the Hex legend....

Like Hex, part of the story could be introduced in the queue-line. Any scenes that interact with the ride itself need to be short but convey detail concisely. Saw at thorpe does it well, although that has the movie for people to understand how props/scenes relate in short clips.


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garyholc
post Jul 16 2009, 8:28 AM
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Just to throw a dampner on things but that hole may be nothing special, may just be for some of the ride workings, workshop perhaps,, mechanisms for the gates, especially if the station is going to be on ground level?
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Inaudible-Whispe...
post Jul 16 2009, 10:07 AM
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QUOTE (JoshC. @ Jul 15 2009, 8:55 PM) *
QUOTE (Inaudible-Whisper @ Jul 15 2009, 2:19 PM) *
I'm not saying definitely, I just think it's a best guess right now. The theme matches, and the element shown would fit in with what we know. I think it will be like Air in that it'll be a twist on an existing element to make it technically a world first - a backwards tilt. 99% of the general public won't even know a tilt coaster exists at all. I don't think a tilt should be any less likely just because we've been shown one and it's a secret weapon. At the end of the day, it's still guess work so their secret is still kept.

The trouble with that theory is that it would then not be a world's first. AT have on a couple of occasions stated it would be a world first, and a tilt coaster would not be a world first.

As for Air not being a world first, couldn't it be argued that Vekoma flyers more known as Lay down coasters, hence the reason for the loading technique, as opposed to a true flying coaster? That would then make Air the first true flying coaster.


As far as I am aware there isn't another coaster on the planet that, partway around the track, a section falls backwards and the trains falls back with it. A traditional tilt coaster goes up a lift hill and the track tilts forward vertically at the top. Yes, that would make the world first claims slight as they both tilt but I don't think any more so than the way Air was considered a world first. Regardless of how you get into the flying position, they're essentially the same kind of coaster capable of the same kind of things, no? Semi-lying above or below the track. It didn't stop Alton from marketing it as a world first nor the public being none the wiser as to the existence of a relatively similar ride. If it was a tilt, the Alton coaster would be unlike any other coaster on the planet and that is all that matters.

I'd actually prefer it to be something nobody has thought of yet, but if the two big ideas flowing around are for drop track and tilt track I'm just saying I find tilt more likely and in the end probably more fun.

This post has been edited by Inaudible-Whisper: Jul 16 2009, 10:09 AM


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coastermadab
post Jul 16 2009, 5:00 PM
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QUOTE (EdwinOkli @ Jul 15 2009, 7:52 PM) *
I can never imagine a stand-up coaster being too comfortable, although I suppose if done well the unusual position can create some real thrills... but it's not something Alton Towers desperately needs.

I think the train may be strange in some way but it's just the way in which it could be that bewilders me. World's Most Uncomfortable Seats... etc.



I think if done well (for example Air) putting rides in some strange position while riding is fantastic. Other times it is not so good for example Vekoma's motorbike coaster I found really horrible and a rough ride and the position you were in and the restraints I found really uncomfortable. I thought it was a good idea, but for me its too dam rough to enjoy!

We may see some worlds first position, or just normal seating. But to be honest, if the coaster ride is amazing does it really matter what "The Worlds First" element will be? you only need to look at Nemesis' success to see my point...

QUOTE (Cjw @ Jul 15 2009, 7:36 PM) *
I wouldn't say that Shockwave was that rough.

It is however, damn boring.



The layout is really dull. I will give you that! Didn't you find the first drop rough? The front of the train, for me, gives the smoothest ride.
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Airtime Addict
post Jul 16 2009, 6:11 PM
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What if the drop-track didn't tilt nor drop straight down, but wobbled and shook in different, random directions on its way down with a different pattern every time? I'm thinking a rollercoaster version of a Tagada.

Each time you rode, much like the Wild Mouse at Blackpool, you'd convince yourself that 'it wasn't as bad as that last time'.

Probably way off the mark and improbable to execute, but would be a nice idea that would add some moments of geniune fear every time you rode it.


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garyholc
post Jul 16 2009, 6:38 PM
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Or what about the track spinning? Similar to the hex room except the track spins around the room?
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Airtime Addict
post Jul 16 2009, 10:20 PM
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By the way, I presume this has been spotted before?

http://www.profeng.com/archive/archive+200...10/22100054.htm


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Inaudible-Whispe...
post Jul 16 2009, 10:55 PM
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QUOTE (garyholc @ Jul 16 2009, 7:38 PM) *
Or what about the track spinning? Similar to the hex room except the track spins around the room?


That could be interesting. Have the track sit on a central pivot like a see-saw, the track could do a full 360 spin before settling at an angle allowing the train to drop backwards. Having the track fully rotational could allow it to be fairly customisable each ride. One time it spins backward, the next time forwards, the next time it half spins leaving people facing vertically down before spinning in the other direction leaving them facing straight up (like a 90 degree see saw) before settling into the standard backwards drop angle...

Regardless of whether a tilt is involved, I still think the element itself has to (assumingly) drop the train giving it the momentum it needs to make it around the helix. Having a world first element and a launch would probably be too expensive, unnecessary and a bit too stop-start for a finale.

This post has been edited by Inaudible-Whisper: Jul 16 2009, 11:00 PM


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garyholc
post Jul 17 2009, 12:18 PM
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QUOTE (Airtime Addict @ Jul 16 2009, 11:20 PM) *
By the way, I presume this has been spotted before?

http://www.profeng.com/archive/archive+200...10/22100054.htm


Interesting, especially the part where he says:

"While rides such as Nemesis have pushed engineering to new limits Wardley says that the coaster industry may be reaching its peak.

“The manufacturers are starting to run out of robust ideas,” he says. “There is a move to go back to basics and some of the best rides in the world are just beautiful, well-engineered, big, basic rides.”


I think he may be right, there is only so much a human body can take and ride designs have pretty much pushed all the limits. I think the future of rides will not be so much about what the ride has to offer which is new in design, but in terms of the environment around the ride, the themeing, the thrills that the area around the ride can give to enhance the overall experience. Which isnt a bad thing!
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JoshC.
post Jul 17 2009, 6:33 PM
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QUOTE (Yeah 7 @ Dec 21 2008, 8:01 PM) *
Here you go Fanboys and Fangirls...

Justins e-mail to the list
QUOTE

[*]It has switchback sections - for reversing direction. I've added a second one inside the building, but that isn't shown on the plans, so the track may be slightly different when indoors. I imagine the car will stop, some sort of action take place which will then cause the car to fly out backwards.
Justin.



From the old SW6 topic. From what I understand from that, we have no actually evidence from the park that there will be a switchback indoors, which basically means some sort of drop / tilt is the most likely idea. As there are a couple of tilts in the world, I'd assume it would be a drop - that's if that is meant to be the world first. However, based on that article, I think the world first is something much bigger and harder to figure out - something much more complicated.
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AdrianB
post Aug 6 2009, 5:11 PM
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There is a SW6 information leaflet available on park from today! wink.gif
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garyholc
post Aug 6 2009, 6:29 PM
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and.....? what does it say?
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AdrianB
post Aug 6 2009, 8:03 PM
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I dont know, I just know there is a leaflet that is now available on park from today. I'm sure it will be on ATA sometime tomorrow.
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Boombox2009
post Aug 6 2009, 8:57 PM
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Oh ade, i told wayne not to tease about it on his fb status earlier now your doing it... wink.gif


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Towers Trips
post Aug 6 2009, 9:19 PM
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Damn I thought ye guys were serious, lol!!


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Boombox2009
post Aug 6 2009, 9:23 PM
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I think it is serious Tower Trips. The wayne mention above is fairly high at towers so its probably true as a cunning thing wink.gif


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neilo333
post Aug 6 2009, 11:45 PM
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its rumoured that the seats are going to be on a sort of robotic arm and apparently that is why SW6 is a world 1st. dry.gif


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AdrianB
post Aug 7 2009, 1:56 AM
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indeed....
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